Navigating Neurodivergence: Energy Hacks for Empaths with Regina Carey

Catherine A. Wood  06:42

Regina, welcome to the podcast. I’m so happy to have you here today.

Regina Carey  06:52

Thank you so much. Excited to be here.

Catherine A. Wood  06:57

I was thinking that when we first connected, I think last winter, you were sharing that you were looking forward to going to Machu Picchu later this spring, which is on my bucket list, a place I was supposed to go to at the beginning of the pandemic, lead a retreat there. And then, kind of our plans got redirected. So I’m excited to kind of hear a little bit about your experience on our episode today. And by way of getting us started, I’d love to invite you to share your pronouns and a little bit of your story, because I know we’re going to dive into your story today, and I think our stories are really what shared with the world about who we are?

Regina Carey  07:45

Very good. Thank you. My pronouns are she her? And, you know, it’s always a little well, entertaining. I laugh inside when I think about sharing my story, it’s sort of the same feeling I used to get when people would say, Well, what do you do at networking events? Least favorite question ever. And you know, I have always been a teacher, and my story really starts as growing up on a farm in a tiny little town in northwestern Ohio, and I would spend my entire day outside, immersed in nature, observing things, sitting in my apple tree and daydreaming. And I think from a very young age, I was always tuned in to the energy of the world, and I had the space and the peace and the quiet to do that, and then, you know, we grow up. And I always thought that I was going to be a teacher who had her classroom for 30 years with my name on the door, and then I would retire, and that would be my life story. But as a special ed teacher, I lived that timeline. The professional timeline of a special educator is three and a half years. And the funny thing I did that almost to the date, but it’s because I had an opportunity to go after my master’s and a Master’s at UNC Chapel Hill that was paid for. How could I turn that down? And so from from that moment on when I said yes to that opportunity, my career has in life really have looked like the Family Circus. Those of you who are old enough to remember the Family Circus when mom would ask Billy to go out and buy a loaf of bread, and he’d go to the park and he’d go visit a friend, and he’d watch the animals, and he’d observe a caterpillar and and so I. I’ve had amazing opportunities across my career to reinvent myself, to start over, and I have faced just about everything that a person can face in a lifetime, birth, death, cancer, addiction, not personally, but in my family, and it has helped me increase my compassion for others, as well as for myself, because that’s really the only way we can do it in the world, is to practice it on ourselves. And I knew when I knew one day when I was out running and I heard the question, what do you do? I ran with that, and the answer said, The answer came to me, it doesn’t matter what you do. What matters is who is in front of you. Who they are is what I really heard. And so I got the word Ubuntu tattooed on my wrist, my left wrist, to remind me that my work is about the person in front of me, and that’s how I’ve been moving forward ever since, wow,

Catherine A. Wood  11:26

that’s really touching. You know, I just as I’m sitting here listening to you enthralled, something that I’m so appreciating is, you know, I’ve had a lot of educators on the show over the last, gosh, year and a half since we launched the podcast, and the teachers and educators that I’ve had on the show are always the best storytellers. And have you noticed that does that I’m curious and curious your opinion on that?

Regina Carey  12:01

I you know, I believe, I believe that it’s because somebody told said that gave that compliment to me just recently, that I was a great storyteller, and I thought, I don’t even think about it. But when you’re an educator, you’re selling information. You’re selling ideas and learning and if you cannot captivate your audience, there it’s it’s pointless. You’re losing money. You’re losing out on, you know, losing money tongue in cheek. But, but the truth is, the only way that we can help others is by sharing something of ourselves, so that there’s a connector. And I always do this sort of linking motion with my hands. I’m very gesticulate, which doesn’t help our audience very much. But if you take your index fingers left and right and hook them together, this is what has got to happen to have learning take place. There’s got to be something where you say, yeah, I get it, or, Oh, I love that, or I know that feeling that you’re describing right now, and when you can create a hook for them. You’ve got to,

Catherine A. Wood  13:26

wow, that’s cool. I that’s, I think that’s really going to resonate with me. And I know, you know, we’re going to chat about how, how empaths can really take care of their own needs, to serve, and particularly serve the person in front of them more deeply. And I have it that it’s really connected with what you just said, that I think our ability to hook the person over there starts with taking care of ourselves over here, which I think is a lot of what your Machu Picchu trip represented for you, and I wanted to jump into the conversation there, and I know we’re going to talk about empathy and energy and neuro divergence, which I’m so excited to dig into with you. But you shared something before we started recording, that I think just really stood out for me, because I think that as empaths, the ways in which we take care of ourselves and set ourselves up to thrive are really different, and they vary, and sometimes we can just kind of roll our eyes at these hot button topics and Words like self care and morning routine and morning ritual, and they don’t really land, because they’re not unique to us and to our nervous systems and to really what helps us to to thrive. And so I’d love to stay My watch is talking to me. Oh. Um, that’s funny. I would love to start our episode today with where I typically end every conversation and invite you to share what what truly makes a difference for you and thriving as a prosperous Empath,

Regina Carey  15:21

I realize, I realized when I saw this question, because nobody’s ever asked me that question. And it’s that, you know, I am able when someone’s in front of me and they’re telling me about themselves or what they’re struggling with, I can feel it. I feel it in my body. I recognize when someone is struggling with a gut issue or a migraine or like, when I’m talking with you, I feel a lot of tension in my shoulders, right? Because you’re, I mean, you’re having to do a lot with your body these days, and I feel that tension in my back, in the upper shoulders, I feel what you feel. And I have learned, especially as a special education teacher, to to stop that urge to go into the emotion with you. I have had to hold it together for a lot of people in my life, and so I’ve learned to compartmentalize my emotions, and I often use this, this gesture of taking the emotion that’s rising in my throat, and I push it down, I move it back, I go, I put it off my body somehow, but not now. Is often what I feel like this is right now. I have to be in showing up for this person in a different way, and see what kind of downloads I get. And so what I recognized is, after a while, I everything is energy, and so that energy has to go somewhere, and it would show up as anxiety. It would show up as insomnia. It would show up as disease, and the first time I recognized it was after my daughter went through addiction at the same time my husband was going through cancer. And I said, I’ve got to do something with my body to move these emotions through me. And so I walked a portion of the Camino to Santiago. Now that’s a 500 mile trek, and I went 200 miles of that, but all I had to do was walk. That was my one job, and it was that’s a lot to put your body through every single day for two weeks, I walked 678, hours a day in Spain. So when I was through with that, that physical exhaustion, the time alone, to to be in a space, to feel the emotions, to cry, to yell, to talk with other people and tell them what I had experienced. And so Machu Picchu was the same. I was gone for two weeks, and I walked up and down many mountains, but Machu Picchu was four days of the most intensive climbing I had ever done in the light, in the dark, in the dry, in the rain, excruciating pain, but my body was so strong, I was healthy and strong The whole time, which was a gift, because I’m 55 I’m not a spring chicken, but I feel like a spring chicken. You have to understand, for all of you out there listening, and I think you probably can identify, I wake up feeling like I’m 16 every day. That’s my young spirit, and that’s why I am passionate about the work I do, because I love it, but I also know that these extreme adventures have to be a part of the way I’m I live my life in order to balance out the extreme emotion.

Catherine A. Wood  19:37

I so appreciate that I completely resonate with those sentiments, and it the same is true for me, and I it reminds me of an episode we recorded earlier this year with Philip Robinson, who’s a highly, highly sensitive coach, and she is the one who introduced me to the term high sensation. Seeking?

Regina Carey  20:00

Ah, yes,

Catherine A. Wood  20:04

and, and it really stuck for me being a high sensation seeker, and in a healthy way, right? Like taking on these extreme physical endeavors, you know, I did cold water swimming all throughout the winter pregnant, and it was so nourishing for my nervous system, and it really quieted the emotions and the just the the anxiety in my body and the DIS ease, as you mentioned, which I honestly don’t experience often these days in life, but, yeah, but it sounded like that stuck a chord for you. What were you going to say about that?

Regina Carey  20:48

Well, and I when you said being in the cold water, you know, I did one of my extreme things was I did a polar plunge. And I despise the cold, warm weather, like Michigan, Michigan. I know Michigan is getting ready to have 90 degree temperatures all week, and I am, I am thrilled. I can’t wait. And I know I often say, What am I doing in Michigan? And that’s a whole different episode. But what happens is, and maybe some of you listening have experienced this, where the people around you who love you the most say you don’t do that. You know you could hurt yourself, you could die. You could you. You’ve never been to a different country, you you’re you’re supposed to be taking care of yourself, don’t you could have a heart attack if you jump in freezing cold water, people around us want to protect us, and we have got to stand our ground and trust what our body is telling us, and all will be well if we listen to the fear, then we are in danger of holding on and constricting and truly down the road, making ourselves sick. And so if you are inspired by something, if you see something, and your heart says, Oh, we got to do that. Trust it,

Catherine A. Wood  22:27

yeah. I mean, I really, I really appreciate that. You know, my extended family hosted me a a big Indian baby shower over this past weekend, and we did this puja ceremony, which is this traditional blessing ceremony to protect the baby. And it was a lot of people, a lot of details, a lot of energy and a lot of stress. And I I could feel the families kind of like, you know, shallow breathing throughout the whole weekend, because there was a lot of tension in the space. And everyone kept telling me, Don’t be stressed. Beta, like, calm down. It’s gonna be okay. And I, I, I kind of was chuckling throughout the weekend, because I wasn’t stressed at all, not one bit. And I think because it’s because of this very thing that we’re talking about, this idea that, you know, when we quiet the external chatter of how other people want to protect us or what they think we need to do in order to protect the baby or take care of ourselves or stay calm. You know, we can actually tune into what helps us quiet the chatter and tune in and stay calm and you know, just like you I, I hiked part of the Cinque Terre trail last month in in Italy to celebrate my 40th birthday. And really have this kind of coming of age experience as I walk into motherhood and no idea what I was getting into. I didn’t even bring hiking shoes. I had white no no support casual day sneakers that looked really cute, oh my gosh, and it was brilliant. And I had a awesome time. And it’s, it’s really these, this very conversation, that is what helps me quiet the chatter and stay calm and not feel that anxiety, because I am nourishing myself in the way that feels great and brings me a lot of joy, you know, like you can see my face lights up as I talk about This, because it’s it’s true for me. Yes,

Regina Carey  24:38

beautiful. We have to be aware of those subtle energy shifts when we fail to listen to ourselves. You know, if we begin to constrict. In any way, or our stomach feels different. You know, somebody says something to us. You know that is the real key to prospering, to evolving, is to honor that subtle shift. I call them micro recoveries. This is really what self care is about. And not a very a big fan of that term self care. I think it’s overused and but if we can say, Yeah, I just did a little micro recovery right there. It reminds me of when we learned how to ride a bike, and when we are learning that and the bike starts to tip, we tend to overcorrect and crash. Those handlebars are very subtle. But when we learn that we can adjust our weight on the seat a little bit, you know, we can, I mean, we could do that. Now it’s a great it’s actually a great technique is to squeeze your butt cheeks together to cue yourself in, to pay attention. But if we can shift our way if we can slightly move those handlebars, it doesn’t take much to take care of yourself, but it’s the recognizing and making that micro recovery. You just Oh, no, I’m going to say no to that, because I felt that when I got invited to that party. I already am going to three different social events this week. I ha, I’m going to say no, because I felt that one like, oh, I even made a face. You know, that’s one of the that’s one of a great, a great indicator for me. My kids always get frustrated with me because I do not have a poker face, and so when I feel something, it shows up on my face, and they can help me identify that, and that’s a surefire sign that I need to say no, totally.

Catherine A. Wood  27:09

So let’s connect some dots here, because, you know, we were going to talk about energy and neurodiversity and and special ed, and I’m wondering how these dots connect for you. How is this conversation about energy, a conversation about neurodiversity?

Regina Carey  27:29

Well, my experience with ADHD started really early, because I was always involved in the special ed organizations, Chad and ADA and lda, all these acronyms, but learning disabilities, attention deficit disorder, and it was round about the time when Ned Hollowell and John rady wrote Driven to Distraction, which is one of the key books that were initially written on ADHD and I was at a conference, and I was lucky enough to be sitting at a table with sari soldin. Well, Sari wrote the book on women with ADHD, and she and I became fast friends. We had a daughter in common and our and more importantly, our daughter’s names. She had just adopted a daughter from Russia named Daria, and that is my firstborn named Daria. Oh, wow. It was wild. We got to talking, and then, and then I found out she lives in Michigan, and so for 20, almost 30 years now, Sarah and I have had a friendship and a mentor, mentee relationship, and I’ve learned so much from her. And what I know is that especially women with ADHD feel so much of everything. They’re aware of everything happening around them, and so unaware of the internal and when that happens, overwhelm sets in, and there’s an absolute flip switch where the best way to protect themselves is to not do anything. And it looks like depression. You know, it looks like laziness. If you’ve ever been called lazy. I’m here to tell you you are not only the busiest, most vivacious, people I’ve met have told me that they feel lazy. I i I know what it’s like to feel. All the fields, and there are things we can do to help manage our energy better, and whether that’s therapy, coaching, medication, exercise, it’s important to find what works? Because many, many people with ADHD are also highly sensitive people, and it’s important to know that you’re not alone and that there are so many ways to support yourself. You only have to do one you know one thing.

Catherine A. Wood  30:45

So it sounds like, through your work that you’ve really discovered that teaching and helping the folks and students and mentees that you work with to manage their energy is a really effective way in thriving in their neurodivergence,

Regina Carey  31:08

yes, and the you know, to bring it all around, the slowing down. I mean, the, you know, the internal engine of a person with an ADHD brain. And I say ADHD because the latest DSM, that’s what it’s no longer add, or ADHD. They’ve classified it as ADHD, so that’s how I refer to it. But they often talk about the Ferrari brain and the, you know, Ford breaks like it’s easy to get caught up in the energy of ADHD, and what’s important is to slow down. And this is how this is how we know, like you referenced, this is how we know to listen to ourselves when we’re taking on everybody else’s stuff. That overwhelm causes us to shut down, whereas, if we can figure out a way to micro correct, micro recover and have a grounding practice where we can pay attention to what our body is telling us, because bodies never lie. We’ve got to slow down to do that, and it’s counterintuitive. When you have ADHD, it’s counterintuitive to slow down you want to move, move, move, move, move,

Catherine A. Wood  32:41

yeah, you know, I ever since you and I first connected, I’ve been looking forward to this conversation, because I have worked with many clients with ADHD over the years, many, many who were either diagnosed before coming to me or through our work together, they became curious and and got tested. I’ve also partnered one of my former some of the people I’ve partnered with previously, also experienced ADHD and so, and I don’t have ADHD, but I do have a very grounding energy. That’s feedback that I receive a lot, and I know this to be true about myself. And so I’m interested in kind of how, how these partnerships work, right? Like how opposites attract, and these kind of energies and contrasting compositions of humans with shared values, they kind of naturally or energetically come together. And so I I’m just fascinated to hear, I’m fascinated to hear more about, you know, how, how do we as coaches and friends and partners, how do we effectively support those we love and care for and partner with to slow down their energy when they’re often, you know, predispositioned to move and create and thrive and grow and scale and have big ideas so powerfully and so quickly. I mean, it’s really kind of like a like a tornado of energy, when I’ve experienced this a lot with clients over the years who just come up with these brilliant, amazing, beautiful business ideas and and I’m wondering, how do, how do we support them in Creating that sustainability factor so they don’t, you know, experience a burnout instead.

Regina Carey  34:47

One of the first is a great it’s a great invitation. And if you are struggling with this as a partner, as a friend, or as a person with ADH. See, the first thing we need to find out is, do you want the support? Do you want someone’s help in this? And it can be as simple as you know, I recognize that I often spend the bulk of my time in the morning looking for things. You can see that that’s frustrating for me, and I would like some support with it. How could we How could we make it so that I can find all the things that I need, like my keys and my purse to get out of the door or whatever it is, so if the person is asking for help, or you are ready to ask for help, start small and determine what it is that is the most frustrating thing for you. You know, we can find a landing zone for all your stuff. We can get we can, you know, create a basket where you just dump everything right by the door. Make it easy on you. That’s a simple strategy. A more complex one is, what do I do with all these ideas? How do I get moving on things? Because I have all these ideas, but I know I don’t know how to do any of them, and I don’t know what step to take. And that’s why working with a coach is so wonderful, and I often use the tool of my post, it in a zoom call, which I’ve got up right now to grab those ideas and put them in a safe place, because many people with ADHD do things like talk fast, interrupt, look like they’re distracted in conversation, because they do not want to lose their thoughts. They do not want to forget what they’re thinking right now, because what they’re thinking is this is so important. It’s so good. And I I know you’re in the middle of a sentence, but I gotta say this, so we interrupt we, I say we. I was side note cat. I was tested. I got tested of November. The irony here is that the doctor that I’m supposed to talk with, we are playing phone tag to talk about the results, so jury’s still out on me, it’s so funny. But I figured if I was diagnosed, if they did find a diagnosis, I would think that I would have had this conversation already. But point being is get permission to help first identify the most egregious thing that’s going on, the most frustrating thing for them in their lives, that they could get some help for. And then one of the one of the easiest strategies, is to move with your loved one to have a conversation. Please stop saying, let’s sit and talk. Let’s sit down and have a meal and discuss. Because that is physically move. Physically move you want to go out of your friend, your spouse, your partner, move, play, play, basketball, pickleball, tennis, go on a walk, walk the dog. Go on a hike, get get side by side treadmills at the gym. That is how you’re going to get the best out of your person. That is how you’re going to really find out how you can be helpful, because with ADHD and any neuro divergency, there’s always this thing called comorbidity. It rarely stands alone. So you most likely have anxiety, depression, a learning disability. And I will tell you the biggest learning disability, the most diagnosed learning disability, is language. A language learning disability. So how we are receiving or producing language, whether that’s audibly written expression, language is a lot for many people with ADHD who are also diagnosed with a learning disability.

Catherine A. Wood  39:28

Tell me more what that means. What is What do you mean by that comorbidity and a language disability?

Regina Carey  39:35

Yeah, well, the comorbidity means, thank you. There’s something else going on. So my husband is a veterinarian and and he often talks about comorbidities in animals, you know, but animals and humans were a lot alike, and there’s always more going on than just the one thing. When it comes to our NE. Energy. And so the the frustrating thing about a learning disability is you, you just can’t see it. We don’t have that clear part to our skulls, like those clocks they used to make, where you could see how they the clock worked, and the gears and all that. That would be lovely, but we don’t have access like that. And so a language learning disability, a learning disability is when there’s a discrepancy between your intelligence. And let’s be real clear on this, people who are diagnosed with a neuro disability have average to above average intelligence. There are often many people who are gifted and have a learning disability. So it has nothing to do with intelligence and everything to do with performance. So you can be brilliant and still not quite understand how to run your dishwasher or your you can’t do things like plan out your week on a calendar, because it’s just too much. But you can sit down at the piano and play Mozart, or you can read a book in a day and retain all of it. So it’s the way that we process things, whether it’s the way we hear things, the way we speak, the way we’re writing, and learning disabilities can be in many areas, language, math, movement, you know, how we navigate the world. It’s very complex.

Catherine A. Wood  41:36

It’s so fascinating, and I really appreciate you mentioning the presence of a language disability, because something that I really appreciate as a coach is that it is a practice to understand our clients style of communication and listening through the story or the ad lib or the detail, to really get to the heart of the matter, to listen to the heart of what they’re trying to communicate. And, you know, I often hear from clients that they feel misunderstood or they can’t communicate or express what they want to say. Or, you know, people in my own life, they often get that feedback as well. And so I would love to hear more from you about, how do you, how do those with a language disability or challenge or obstacle, how to how do they work through it for themselves? And then, how do they partner with people who they don’t just pay like a coach who’s trained to listen through, to really communicate effectively and to be understood? Because, you know, I think that’s one of the greatest sadnesses I have with clients around their communication challenges, is they feel so often misunderstood.

Regina Carey  43:01

And you know what, Kat, I really believe this. This is our this is our need for immediacy. We are so used to having answers immediately. And the simplest way to navigate this challenge, I’m going to give one strategy, ask for time, processing time. So what does this sound like? Thank you for bringing that question up to me. I will have an answer for you by tomorrow morning at eight o’clock. Will that work? Sure I understand that you’d like to know what the whole week plan is for our family, and I require a little bit of time to get into the multiple calendars for our children and myself. So let’s plan to meet back here noon on Saturday to look at the week ahead, and I’ll have the information ready. Advocating for yourself will give you the time and space you need to process what has just been brought to you, because when we give answers immediately, it can end poorly, Over scheduling ourselves over yesing, stressing ourselves out, double booking, triple booking. Has that ever happened to anybody I once triple booked? Oops. And then you know what we’re doing when we learn how to advocate for our needs when it comes to using language, is that you. We avoid the guilt, the shame, the frustration, the anxiety, the shutdown, the sickness, you name it. How does your stress show up in your life? We can avoid that by learning how to use our voice and ask for what we need. And this doesn’t mean self disclosing. You know, you don’t have to give all these reasons for why you need it, but it’s no different than saying, you know, I’m I have diabetes. I have to take my insulin shot before I eat this thing or whatever. And nobody would question that. But yet, somehow or I need to go get my glasses so I can read this. Give me five minutes. Nobody would question that. What you’re asking for is time for your brain to process. And so another, another way this looks is you go to your supervisor and say, I know we are meeting on Monday. Could I get the agenda on Friday so I have time to look at it before we meet? So getting it ahead of time, so that you have time to process the written information, because you might come to that meeting then with three questions that you would not have been able to ask in the moment at the meeting on Monday.

Catherine A. Wood  46:20

Yeah, I really appreciate that response. And I hear just a couple layers at just the the potency of asking for time, for those of us who identify as people pleasers or givers or caretakers, because it’s so often with that time and spaciousness and often physical separation, that we can tune into our own, our own needs, and not have them kind of out outspoken by everyone else’s needs and expectations for us. And I’m also just present to the reminder that you know we train people what to expect from us. So if you know, we’ve trained those we love in that they can expect an immediate response from us, and then we become frustrated or resentful or angry that we’re always feeling that pressure to respond in the moment. You know, we have to take stock and also just take a little responsibility for you know, we created that dynamic. We can recreate it. We can, I can retrain them in some other style or form of communicating.

Regina Carey  47:40

I was just holding this up. I have this picture of an animated queen with your little scepter that is saying ping, and underneath it says, Make a new rule. This is our reminder that at any point in your life, day hour, you can make a new rule for yourself. Yeah, we have the power to do that. Folks, do it,

Catherine A. Wood  48:07

and you’re into and let it be fun. You know, I guess

Regina Carey  48:12

do it with a thing, do it with

Catherine A. Wood  48:17

this has been such a, just a really touching conversation. And something that strikes me is how, how personal it feels for you. This feels like such a really heart centered, heart focused topic for you. And I’m wondering, I’m wondering, why, like, what’s so personal about about this for you,

Regina Carey  48:48

when I was growing up, all the women in my life were people pleasing. You know, I grew up in a time where at the family gatherings, it was expected that the men would be watching television or football or smoking their cigars or doing whatever together, and the women were in the kitchen, cleaning, cooking, tending to the children. And whenever I they had the social going on, there was always a paint it always looked like a painted smile, never really sincere. And on top of that, they were always trying to lose weight. The women in my life were always trying to lose weight and make themselves better, but they were doing it through smoking or, you know, pills or and the struggle like I always wondered, what is it that you really want? In your life, you know, I wonder who I would be today, had I had models of women who spoke their truth, who took action on their life, who did what they wanted to do. My mom went back to school after having three children to get her degree and it was about that midlife time when I saw her reinventing herself and transitioning again and again and again. She went from raising children to getting her degree to becoming a working professional, to becoming a world traveler, to becoming a cancer survivor and then a widow, and then an author. And it was hard on her heart. You know, cancer mainly, and she just died last year from her congestive heart failure and some of the complications of her cancer, almost 26 years earlier. And what I know is when we begin to live life on our terms, listening to our hearts and speaking what it is that we want, not worried about what anyone else thinks. We wouldn’t worry what other people thought of us if we knew how little they thought of us. So I have been on a mission to break the patterns of heart disease in my family, both sides, by moving by healthy eating, nourishing myself with first source foods. I do have a glass of wine occasionally, but I I listen to what it is that my body wants. And you know, that’s what we do when we are on these walks, in these adventures, when I am by myself and I am using my body to that degree, I have to listen to what it wants and some of the best advice my mother ever gave me, anyone for that matter. And I’ll end it with this drink before you’re thirsty, eat before you’re hungry, rest before you’re tired.

Catherine A. Wood  52:44

Mm, hmm. Cheers to that. That’s beautiful. It makes me think of one of my favorite teachers. Of late, I’ve been doing a lot of work with Nicholas Yani, and he he’s done a lot of work around purpose and healing, kind of the intergenerational trauma that we hold in our bodies. And I took a seminar with him recently where he was providing a couple distinctions around how to how to discover whether you’re in alignment with your purpose, and also the relationship between your purpose and your work. And he says that one of the key ingredients to ensure that we are being purposeful in this life, what it will require of us is to care a lot less about what others think of us, and how simple but how profound.

Regina Carey  53:50

Yes, and I

Catherine A. Wood  53:52

think that that is a real practice for driving empaths to care a lot less about what others think of us to really embrace our own inner weird.

Regina Carey  54:06

I love it so true. It’s so true. We spend so much of our life trying to fit in, when really the key is to stand out.

Catherine A. Wood  54:22

Yeah, well, Regina, you certainly stand out. I’ve so enjoyed our conversation today. Thank you so much for taking the time. I always appreciate that when you know i From the first time I meet someone to when we record our interview, when that that window is extended, it always makes the conversation that much more anticipated and worthwhile. So this has been a beautiful conversation. I appreciate you and the work you’re doing,

Regina Carey  54:48

and I appreciate you, cat. Thank you.